Author Topic: S2a 109 Station Wagon, APN 114-266/177-022?  (Read 437 times)

Offline James J

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S2a 109 Station Wagon, APN 114-266/177-022?
« on: March 15, 2021, 08:37:29 PM »
Hi All,

Warning this is quite a long post. Any information will be greatly appreciated.

I am the current custodian of a S2a 109 Station Wagon which currently resides in Christchurch, New Zealand. I have been doing some research on its history and have come across a mystery.

The APN in the remlr database is 114-266 which is based on it's current engine (25278795H) and chassis (25320507C). The chassis number is listed on the transfer gears plate (mounted just in front of the gear stick) as the Vehicle No. The nomenclature plate lists the chassis number as 26210883G which I'm thinking was its original chassis number. The census is 6023.

This is the 109 station wagon mentioned on remlr's "Late Series 2a 10 Seat Wagon" page as being "an nice -but puzzling- example of the Aussie Army 2A Wagon".

So from what is meantioned on that page and in the ARN record the workshop truck ARN 114-266 (census 6035) was used as a donor for the chassis, engine and front end (hence the lights mounted beside the radiator and the cutaway mud guards).

What I need help with is possibly confirmation of its original chassis number (and therefore its original APN 177-022 which could link these two APN records??) and the confusing BBB records which seem to show that the 26210883G chassis went on be fitted with a different engine (590102854D) and was finally disposed of in 05.03.90 where as my Landy was disposed of on 12.06.84.

The B.B.B does not seem to mention the chassis switch etc.

As mentioned at the start I would really appreciate any help with this.

James.

Offline Carzee

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Re: S2a 109 Station Wagon, APN 114-266/177-022?
« Reply #1 on: March 17, 2021, 01:22:37 PM »


Ex-Army Australian Wagons were popular and good looking amongst enthusiasts - for a start you could fit the kids in the back. I also know of one example of a civvy wagon that was reconditioned privately about 2005 or so and done to look exactly like a late Series 2A Army wagon.

Tracking info on the ARN and chassis and having a matching body gets murky because records are obviously 50 years old and some are missing or mixed up - we do not know of a book showing how many chassis/body swaps were done in the Army reconditioning project in the late 60's / early '70s.

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https://www.remlr.com/ARN/ARNseries2_part177.php

In the Wagon list, ARNs 177-xxx, we see some examples of Aust Army Base Workshop re-chassis jobs:

117-027 Wagon body onto a 253 Workshop chassis 114-142
177-028 Wagon body onto a 253 Fire tender chassis 116-938 without any BBB write-up
114-235 Workshop body onto a Wagon 262 chassis 177-029
114-225 Workshop body onto a Wagon 262 chassis 177-031


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http://www.remlr.com/ARN/ARNs_NZ.php

That NZ list has a Workshop Truck ARN 114263 chassis 25320509C purchased by NZ Army. So it can serve as a proof that Aussie Army Workshops did get signed over to NZ Army. Could be very relevant info as well.


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ARN 177-022 .... is 26210883G

James you say "114-266 which is based on it's current engine 25278795H and chassis 25320507C" and the body has a ID plate 26210883G on the firewall in front of the gearstick.

Does it have any 2 Base Workshops record plate?

Offline James J

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Re: S2a 109 Station Wagon, APN 114-266/177-022?
« Reply #2 on: March 18, 2021, 08:53:34 PM »
Hi Carzee,

Thanks for your reply and the info/links.

The photo I attached was the nomenclature plate which is mounted on the side of the front passenger seat along with the servicing plate. It is hard to see but the chassis number 26210883G is on there. The plate that is mounted on the firewall has the chassis number 25320507C on it but under the heading Vehicle No. (I will upload that photo after this post).

So I have one plate which links to 177-022, presumably for the cab itself (??) and another to 114-266 for the chassis and engine and likely the end. At least that is what I'm thinking at the moment but I would like some help confirming that if possible.

I do not know what a 2 Base Workshops record plate is, the only other plate is also on the firewall which has:

Produced by pressed metal corp ltd. Sydney
Body No. LRL 15898
Ser. No. 10915898

You will see this is the same photo I will upload.

If my truck has the cab of 177-022 and the chassis/engine/front end of 114-266 why would the original chassis of 177-022 (26210883G) be refitted with a different engine (590102854D) but still retain it's census code of 6023 (station wagon) when it no longer has a station wagon cab??

I realise I am restating the same questions from my first post but hopefully what information I have provided is now a little clearer.

Again any help would be appreciated.

I haven't got any current photos of the Landy, I will take some in the weekend and post them.

James.

Offline mike_k

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Re: S2a 109 Station Wagon, APN 114-266/177-022?
« Reply #3 on: March 19, 2021, 08:45:17 AM »
Hi James,

This is an interesting one.

When you get to see the vehicle, check the actual stamped chassis number on the Left rear spring hanger.

Over the years, anything is possible with previous owners using parts from different vehicles, probably post service.

You definitely have the bulkhead from 177 022, the question is do you have the chassis from the workshop or the wagon.  Both of these chassis are different to each other, so it would take a bit of modification to fit the wagon body onto the workshop chassis for example.

The rebuild plate Carzee mentions was from 2 Base Workshop which the Australian Army used for major rebuilds of vehicles, a lot went through after Vietnam service. It is a fairly large aluminium plate stamped with the rebuild data.

Let us know what you find!

Offline Carzee

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Re: S2a 109 Station Wagon, APN 114-266/177-022?
« Reply #4 on: March 22, 2021, 07:20:25 PM »
just putting up an example of the 2nd base workshop plate.

Offline Tankradio

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Re: S2a 109 Station Wagon, APN 114-266/177-022?
« Reply #5 on: March 23, 2021, 07:45:42 PM »
Many years ago (1985/86) when I was serving in 26 Transport Squadron Puckapunyal - yes - with Mick,
One of the other Mack drivers told me he had been on detachment to Royal Military College Duntroon a year before and while on a tactical  exercise in the Brindabella Ranges had ran off a fire trail and rolled the series 2A station Wagon he was driving.

I can't recall the circumstances but he was still a well regarded driver so obviously he wasn't held to blame.

I do recall that he said the wagon had rolled several times, been written off and returned to workshops to be rebuilt as it had been on strngth at RMC and was considered valuable.

It is possible that wagon was rebuilt using a written off RAEME Workshop Rover chassis.

Cheers

Phill
AKA Tankradio, Army Veteran & retired Detective, owner, 1944 GPW USMC Ambulance project, 1953 Ferret Mk1, 1954 Ferret Mk2, 1963 No1 Mk3 International GS, 1964 2A Land Rover RAEME Workshop, 1971 No1 Mk4 International GS, 1978 S3 Land Rover FFR RAAC, 1978 S3 Land Rover FFR RAE, 1988 Perentie GS Ex SAS

Offline James J

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Re: S2a 109 Station Wagon, APN 114-266/177-022?
« Reply #6 on: April 18, 2021, 02:30:53 PM »
Hi All,

Sorry for the slow reply.

I have checked the stamped chassis number and it is 25320507C which is the chassis form the workshop truck 114-266.

The engine number is actually different to what I thought it was. It is 251451409040C which comes from a Series IIA 109-inch 3/4-ton Automotive Repair Shop Truck with the ARN 108-609.

So my Landy has:

- The cabin/body of a station wagon from177-022
- The chassis, dash/firewall, engine bay from 114-266
- Engine from 108-609.

There is no 2 Base Workshop plate like that shown in the Carzee's photo.

I have taken some photos now so will post them.

I had to have the front doors replaced as they were rusted out. The paint isn't the best match.

James.

Offline James J

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Re: S2a 109 Station Wagon, APN 114-266/177-022?
« Reply #7 on: April 18, 2021, 02:41:11 PM »
Photo from the rear.

Offline mike_k

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Re: S2a 109 Station Wagon, APN 114-266/177-022?
« Reply #8 on: April 20, 2021, 08:27:37 AM »
Well I guess that solves that James,

Anything is possible here, but - given the fact that the ARN register does not show a body change for the workshop vehicle (114-266), and the wagon entry (177-022)  also does not show a chassis change, my guess is that this combination of body / chassis and engine was done post service by a civilian owner.

As Carzee said, the wagon is / was a highly desirable vehicle, so if someone used it on the beach for a while, with the resulting rust issues, it may have been decided to replace the chassis and bulkhead with a better one to keep the wagon on the road.

At the end of the day, its great to see it still around, they are a great looking variant!

Offline James J

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Re: S2a 109 Station Wagon, APN 114-266/177-022?
« Reply #9 on: April 20, 2021, 05:28:18 PM »
Thanks for everyone's input on this. It is in reasonable condition after a bunch of dollars and many weekends of rust killing/painting.

Very fun to drive around that's for sure.

Offline mike_k

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Re: S2a 109 Station Wagon, APN 114-266/177-022?
« Reply #10 on: April 20, 2021, 06:18:19 PM »
All of your hard work has paid off Id say James,

The 2A wagon is a great vehicle, the military version even better!