Perentie Long Range Camping Vehicle - LRCV

[Carzee]

This thread is about preparations and mods for long trips.
Rod introduced me to his LRCV at Corowa. It is kitted out well.

The LRCV is not just about having good kit.

Some ground rules: KISS (simplicity where possible), suitability/reliability of materials or parts, and leave minimal trace. "Leave minimal trace" is referring to the desire to keep the vehicle substantially unmodified and so that if the LRCV is required for a display or to support an ANZAC Day for instance, items can be removed and the vehicle can be paraded in the appearance it had while in service in the ADF. That means taking care not to drill holes, or if there is no alternative except to drill etc, to at least think it through to work out alternatives and not to drill holes etc in easily seen places.   

[Carzee]

Where to start? I have been testing out gear and seeing how practical it is for one thing. More on that later posts.

This thread was prompted today because I'm thinking through two ideas this week.

Both relate to the trip in 2017 which includes the Canning-Punctures-and-Rip-Off-Diesel-Route. The stories I have read tell of $3.60 diesel and of rips in low-tyre-pressure-sidewalls trap -done on the short stretch of sharp rocky track because they didn't re-inflate from the sand pressures, etc.

1. mounting a 2nd spare tyre (std issue Perentie Michelin).
2. adding an extra fuel tank, cheaply.


1. Spare tyre number on the bonnet? or on the floor of the rear tub? or on a bracket/gadget (custom made) to stand upright on the rear cross member? At Corowa I purchased a 6x6 roof mount for a spare tyre and it needs two bolts to mount the bracket. The bonnet does have bracing in the middle, I have checked. Hmmm.

2. I have an FFR and an empty under-center-seat stash locker (its behind and parallel with the front seat bulkhead). I wonder what CES gear was stashed in there? Cables perhaps? Rations, Ice and stubbies? The locker is approx. 900 wide, 225 high and 380 across. If I used it for ropes, tent pegs, or tools or spares as some examples, its stupid/impractical to unload the whole rear tub to access the stash if something like recovery gear is required. I think a fuel bladder could go in the through the locker door and be filled using one of the two rough and daggy 25mm holes already installed by Australia' finest on the center seat panel (the roof panel of the stash locker). The floor of the rear tub is a tad higher than the top of the standard Perentie fuel tank so it could drain (by the turn of a valve) into an empty main tank. To fill it would mean having the driver side canopy rolled up, clearing gear off "the seat" and reaching inboard with the bowser hose. Sounds simple but could it be reliable?
Item: Australian made fuel bladder. http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/100L-Diesel-Petrol-or-Chemical-Bladder-Flexible-Fuel-Bladder-FB100SP-/321119584438

Any comments on that?

[Hot Rover]

Hi Ross
I am looking foward to seeing what ideas come up here. I like the fuel bladder that you linked to.
Cheers
Rod

[ReignCKD]

Run the Spares like MK1 RFSV, run a 100L tank where the regular spare is mounted (think dervish). Very interested to see what you come up with.

[Carzee]

Regarding extra fuel and water, I like jerrys. I like the simplicity. I have tested the newish Pro-Quip diesel jerrys I purchased at the 2014 LR Expo. I laid down 5 or 6 full diesel jerrys on the rear floor (sitting on cheap neoprene camp mats). I drove around December through January, on road and off road, nearly 7 weeks without any leaks. Assuming the CSR is not going to take more than 15 or 16 days, I think carrying an extra 100 litres or so in horizontal steel jerrys and 100 litres in a bladder would be adequate.

Then there's the water jerrys to consider. How many litres for 15 -16 days?

[FFRMAN]

Regarding extra fuel and water, I like jerrys. I like the simplicity. I have tested the newish Pro-Quip diesel jerrys I purchased at the 2014 LR Expo. I laid down 5 or 6 full diesel jerrys on the rear floor (sitting on cheap neoprene camp mats). I drove around December through January, on road and off road, nearly 7 weeks without any leaks. Assuming the CSR is not going to take more than 15 or 16 days, I think carrying an extra 100 litres or so in horizontal steel jerrys and 100 litres in a bladder would be adequate.

Then there's the water jerrys to consider. How many litres for 15 -16 days?

Hi Ross,

re Water, they say 20lt per person per day when out back in hot weather, so scale back from that for mild weather

My only comment with steel jerry can (when travelling outback) is be careful they don't rub against each other, surprisingly steel will rub through and leak quicker than plastic, I've always had them standing up (the base is more solid) and packed tight, strapped down and cardboard between them to take up the rubbing.

regards

[Carzee]

Run the Spare tyres like MK1 RFSV, run a 100L tank where the regular spare is mounted (think dervish). Very interested to see what you come up with.

If When I get a flat, I think the easiest spare tyre to access is the classic mount, the Series LR tyre-on-bonnet. Certainly the 6x6 roof mount bracket is designed to operate on a horizontal panel. For the 2000km of the Canning Stock Route and other remote tracks perhaps I could stash one of the spares on the front bar or the rear crossmember area using a custom bracket. The RFSV mk1 has the spares mounted on the inside verticals of the ROPS. Its certainly a good spot from the point of view of the weight distribution. I think I would use rachet straps and avoid welding on mounting brackets. The drawback is that to access the spares a lot of cargo has to be moved. Hmmm.

Putting a station wagon fuel tank under the rear tub means I lose a spare tyre spot. But certainly this tank underneath idea has me thinking.

[DennisM]

Ross, if you are considering a fuel tank under the rear forget the std L/R 80lt one, splash out and buy a long range tank that will hold 120lts, just my tuppence worth, it will cost more than tuppence though, cheers Dennis
http://thelongranger.com.au/defenderlongrangefueltank.html

[ReignCKD]

Run the Spare tyres like MK1 RFSV, run a 100L tank where the regular spare is mounted (think dervish). Very interested to see what you come up with.

If When I get a flat, I think the easiest spare tyre to access is the classic mount, the Series LR tyre-on-bonnet. Certainly the 6x6 roof mount bracket is designed to operate on a horizontal panel. For the 2000km of the Canning Stock Route and other remote tracks perhaps I could stash one of the spares on the front bar or the rear crossmember area using a custom bracket. The RFSV mk1 has the spares mounted on the inside verticals of the ROPS. Its certainly a good spot from the point of view of the weight distribution. I think I would use rachet straps and avoid welding on mounting brackets. The drawback is that to access the spares a lot of cargo has to be moved. Hmmm.

Putting a station wagon fuel tank under the rear tub means I lose a spare tyre spot. But certainly this tank underneath idea has me thinking.

For the off-highway driving I do I would prefer not having the spare on the hood/bonnet. While I do agree that you will likely end up with a flat tire at some point or another, I wouldn't disregard the idea over a minor inconvenience of having to unload the car a bit, but i suppose the same could be said for running it on the hood.

I am running ex-us military 20L Plastic Sceptre fuel containers, and I plan to get a plastic water jerry from them too. I did not like the idea of a metal jerry considering diesel has water in it, and water and steel = rust! See Pic below.

[Carzee]

Nice fuel containers. Its good to see the US is going metric -joking. Those must have been for european deployments or somewhere foreign. I agree about rusty jerrys which is why I got new ones. They also serve well under plywood as a table, and also to sit on.

We are talking quite a distance between re-fuel on the CSR track. I just found this video of a CSR trek successfully done from south to north in mid 2015 by John Ford and Peter Constable with the usual TLC, Triton, Prado white fleet vehicles.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-XfbnhMWXFA

Its about 20mins long and semi-pro, start to finish, except for a little microphone work. Even Gaynor the walker http://www.canningwalker.com is there doing a followup in her Perentie. She has immersed herself in the indigenous culture, shades of 'Dances With Wolves'. The photography there is first rate. The trek's reds -red everything- are tops. Makes me wanna go right away.

The TLC has a 160litre aux tank. In the video, at about 10 minutes into the video, they visit the CSR midpoint mechanic/fuel stop at the Kunawarritji Community near well 33 (somewhere in the Mt Newman latitudes). The diesel and unleaded price is $3.40 per litre (about 4 litres = 1 US gallon so thats about US$10 per gallon).

They also quiz the local mechanic about what is the most common breakdown (he says about 900 vehicles per year do the CSR trek). Its not flat tyres - its dead shock absorbers and suspension mountings from people overloading fuel and water... so we have to get it right.

Seen in the video are various dead 4x4 and trailers: intermittently, like roadkill. also ref. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canning_Stock_Route

In this video, 4 minutes long, which is all about CSR terrain and technique, you can see why a trailer is not going to be a good idea for the LRCV...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-nKJPgFFsEM

So I won't be taking the trailer, or a tinny on the roof. Not a fishing fan anyway. A quiet little kayak could be nice for a few hours here and there but it is worth carting my own canoe/kayak all around the country (+fuel) or just hiring one when the opportunity comes up?

The lack of straight runs up onto many many of the hundreds of dunes -it kills momentum- means the engines have to sit near the red line if you are dragging a trailer and even if not dragging a trailer sometimes. After hundreds of kilometres of that sort of work, the engine and driveline may show signs of being fatigued. And its a long way home.

[Carzee]

Ref to shock absorbers mentioned above. More - watch another CSR trek video by a foreign semi-pro team using five or so G-Wagens in 2011 like an imitation Camel trophy run.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1fNwKYPX5ws

They mention the Australian Army G-Wagen purchase of course, first up... In the first 3 minutes of video, around Well 10 of the 50+ wells if they are lucky, all five MB G-Wagens have blown their rear shockies which are Bilsteins. The shockies are shown the camera - they're bent and busted like they were in a 100mph prang (wreck in US speak). They are mulling over a $20,000 quote to fly in replacement shockies (and spares) for all the team. I note that they are all wearing new hats, including the Murcedes technicians on the team. Some tourist shop near the Kalgoorlie airport must've had a good day.

[Carzee]

Cuppa time:
About an hour back we went up for a sunset brew up at a local lookout. Autumn leaves have started to appear all over. We keep all the brew up gear in a removable console between the seats. It works like a basket; its a water jerry with one side cut out and sat horizontally between the front seats. Most often I just lift it out and put it on the bonnet and assemble the little gas burner. Sometimes, if its too breezy we park up against the wind and put out the FFR Aux battery tray to cook on.

[Carzee]

Batteries:
I mounted two batteries in one of the FFR Aux battery lockers. I sprayed the shiny new terminals with a laquer product used to spray PCBs. I have had good results with this before: http://www.jaycar.com.au/Service-Aids/Chemical-Aids/Aerosols/Circuit-Board-Lacquer-Spray-Can/p/NA1002

There's one engine and one deep battery. Both are Cat batteries and both are topped up/monitored by the Red Arc Isolator I put under the passenger seat in the old engine battery position. The extra power is for either a e-winch or e-fridge, neither of which I have settled on as yet, I don't own any brand or have any experience in these items.

[ReignCKD]

Ref to shock absorbers mentioned above. More - watch another CSR trek video by a foreign semi-pro team using five or so G-Wagens in 2011 like an imitation Camel trophy run.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1fNwKYPX5ws

They mention the Australian Army G-Wagen purchase of course, first up... In the first 3 minutes of video, around Well 10 of the 50+ wells if they are lucky, all five MB G-Wagens have blown their rear shockies which are Bilsteins. The shockies are shown the camera - they're bent and busted like they were in a 100mph prang (wreck in US speak). They are mulling over a $20,000 quote to fly in replacement shockies (and spares) for all the team. I note that they are all wearing new hats, including the Murcedes technicians on the team. Some tourist shop near the Kalgoorlie airport must've had a good day.

My setup if you could even call it one is/will be pretty mild compared to yours. I have purchased the helper spring setup with the plates, this setup was less than $100usd shipped from LRdirect. These are the inner coils that RFSV and 130 use. I have not looked into what shock absorber to use, but I will try to get my hands on a decent set for a reasonable cost. Here, especially around me we do not have the ability to lose civilization all together in a few hours drive (or at all comparatively). Right now with my current stock setup I am good for about 450 miles on sealed roads, which is ok, but I would like a bit more range than that!

[Carzee]

I like the sound of the helper springs. Do you have the part numbers handy - I think it would be a good investment considering the continual cargo, day in day out, as we go on our way.

You mention fuel range and I have has some more thinking on those bladders. The proper fuel tank underneath the rear as per the station wagons is a good choice - there are some mountings and mods and there is no visible cosmetic effect - its all under the vehicle (so it fits the "tread lightly criteria" mentioned at the top of the thread). The problem is the cost, over $900.

The bladder idea could be better suited to the LRCV as a water bladder. All the bladders, fuel or water, have a wide inlet hose and a 13mm outlet hose. Empyting/draining is not an issue. You just hang the outlet lower than the tank and let gravity work, decanting to a jerry perhaps.

What does appear to be a hassle is the fill up: spilling some diesel would be undesirable, mainly because of the stink. I assume there would be spillage due to the slow filling - I cannot see how the air is going to come out when you fill up (breathing) without making a mess. Water spillage would be no problem. And if the bladder ever gets a small leak... as I said water spills no problem.

Here is the water version of the bladder that would be suitable, oversize for the locker but that would mean less stress on seams.
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Water-bladder-tank-140-Ltrs-for-4x4-Camping-Fishing-and-Boating-/221236154980?

So then back to jerrys for the diesel. As mentioned, I already have 9 new diesel jerrys purchased at half price "sales" that come up sometimes.

How to pack them in? This how I see it at this time:

Two jerrys on the back crossmember.
Six laying horizontally on the tub floor, utilising some of those cheap neoprene camping mats to stop friction underneath and between the jerrys.

Thats 8 jerrys (160 litres) plus the std tank under the driver.
I could also temporarily strap two more jerrys between the front seats on the 12mm plywood base I have there - after the first day they'd be empty and moved onto a roof rack or somewhere out of the way.

Thats ten jerrys, 160 litres plus 70litres in the std tank, 230litres. That weighs about 230kg. I will buy a bit more "safety factor" diesel at the midway point on the CSR (at that crazy price).