Author Topic: REMLR list of Tac numbers SVN etc  (Read 12686 times)

Offline Diana Alan

  • REMLR Inc
  • Veteran
  • *
  • Posts: 2238
  • THANKS 108
REMLR list of Tac numbers SVN etc
« on: April 10, 2013, 09:20:31 PM »
I wonder if we should create a database of unit numbers for tac signs.  Particularly in SVN and the dates.

e.g. 17 const sqn "108" and the recent photo of ? 103 signals "401".
REMLR 240.
Perentie FFR 50-422, SIII FFR 30-146, SIIA GunBuggy 112-726, Mk3 Inter 170-437, ex-SADF SIIB/SIII Radio Relay,
Army Trailers: No5 x 2, W/S x 2, PT1-1.2, Horndraulic ATR dog trailer.
Civilian: MY85 RRc HiLine 4.6, MY51 ex-RACQ 80", MY91 Defender/Reynolds Boughton 6x6, MY12 D4 SDV6

Offline Phoenix

  • Administrator
  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 2164
  • THANKS 85
    • REMLR
  • Location: Launceston, Tasmania
  • REMLR No: 129
Re: REMLR list of Tac numbers SVN etc
« Reply #1 on: April 11, 2013, 10:59:07 AM »
I started on that last week  :D

So far most of the information is from Mud and Dust, but I will be expanding on that.  It will appear on the vehicle parkings page soon I hope.
REMLR Webmaster
Eden - 1961 Series 2 Ambulance, 108-098

Offline Diana Alan

  • REMLR Inc
  • Veteran
  • *
  • Posts: 2238
  • THANKS 108
Re: REMLR list of Tac numbers SVN etc
« Reply #2 on: April 11, 2013, 01:27:51 PM »
FAB
REMLR 240.
Perentie FFR 50-422, SIII FFR 30-146, SIIA GunBuggy 112-726, Mk3 Inter 170-437, ex-SADF SIIB/SIII Radio Relay,
Army Trailers: No5 x 2, W/S x 2, PT1-1.2, Horndraulic ATR dog trailer.
Civilian: MY85 RRc HiLine 4.6, MY51 ex-RACQ 80", MY91 Defender/Reynolds Boughton 6x6, MY12 D4 SDV6

Offline Phoenix

  • Administrator
  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 2164
  • THANKS 85
    • REMLR
  • Location: Launceston, Tasmania
  • REMLR No: 129
Re: REMLR list of Tac numbers SVN etc
« Reply #3 on: April 11, 2013, 04:18:26 PM »
Ok, I have the list done, in no small part thanks to Mud and Dust by Mike Cecil.

As a test I ran through some photos from vietnam to make sure I could pick up most units, and struck an 85 on RAASC background (blue and yellow Diagonal) on a F2 Inter.  Now 86 Transport Platoon was 86, but what was 85??
« Last Edit: April 11, 2013, 04:19:57 PM by Phoenix »
REMLR Webmaster
Eden - 1961 Series 2 Ambulance, 108-098

Offline Phoenix

  • Administrator
  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 2164
  • THANKS 85
    • REMLR
  • Location: Launceston, Tasmania
  • REMLR No: 129
Re: REMLR list of Tac numbers SVN etc
« Reply #4 on: April 11, 2013, 04:19:41 PM »
and another one, white 77 on black on an ambulance.
REMLR Webmaster
Eden - 1961 Series 2 Ambulance, 108-098

Offline Phoenix

  • Administrator
  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 2164
  • THANKS 85
    • REMLR
  • Location: Launceston, Tasmania
  • REMLR No: 129
Re: REMLR list of Tac numbers SVN etc
« Reply #5 on: April 11, 2013, 04:50:06 PM »
Oh, and the 401 for 104 Sigs is wrong, on their website they even ask what the story there was.  apart from being 104 backwards.  theirs was actually 403.
REMLR Webmaster
Eden - 1961 Series 2 Ambulance, 108-098

Offline Phoenix

  • Administrator
  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 2164
  • THANKS 85
    • REMLR
  • Location: Launceston, Tasmania
  • REMLR No: 129
Re: REMLR list of Tac numbers SVN etc
« Reply #6 on: April 11, 2013, 04:52:46 PM »
47 on horizontal red and blue. another unknown.
REMLR Webmaster
Eden - 1961 Series 2 Ambulance, 108-098

Offline Diana Alan

  • REMLR Inc
  • Veteran
  • *
  • Posts: 2238
  • THANKS 108
Re: REMLR list of Tac numbers SVN etc
« Reply #7 on: April 11, 2013, 06:49:12 PM »
Oh, and the 401 for 104 Sigs is wrong, on their website they even ask what the story there was.  apart from being 104 backwards.  theirs was actually 403.
Maybe, however I was thinking it was 103 Sigs.

Only because of the "Pentropic" making it early in the War and therefore before 104 Sigs were deployed.

I wonder if we should create a database of unit numbers for tac signs.  Particularly in SVN and the dates.

e.g. 17 const sqn "108" and the recent photo of ? 103 signals "401".
REMLR 240.
Perentie FFR 50-422, SIII FFR 30-146, SIIA GunBuggy 112-726, Mk3 Inter 170-437, ex-SADF SIIB/SIII Radio Relay,
Army Trailers: No5 x 2, W/S x 2, PT1-1.2, Horndraulic ATR dog trailer.
Civilian: MY85 RRc HiLine 4.6, MY51 ex-RACQ 80", MY91 Defender/Reynolds Boughton 6x6, MY12 D4 SDV6

Offline zulu delta 534

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 247
  • THANKS 99
  • Location: Loganlea
  • REMLR No: 226
Re: REMLR list of Tac numbers SVN etc
« Reply #8 on: April 11, 2013, 07:04:54 PM »
Where more than one Corps was involved within a Unit, such as a training school, or in this particular case more specifically, a Field Ambulance unit where the transport element was RAASC and the Medical side was RAMC, then the Tac sign did not carry any specific Corps colour background. In this case the numbers become important, and these are issued (usually) from Canberra.
Therefore the black background states "non Corps specific" and the "76" represents 2 Field Ambulance and the "77" represents 8 Field Ambulance who later replaced "2" in the theatre.
Not too far down the line from these two numbers is "79" which is often mistakenly identified in black and white shots as also being on a black background where in actual fact it was on a diagonally divided "Red/Black" plate and represents the Military Police.
Back in 1966 when Operation Hardihood was first launched (the insertion of 1 ATF and 1 ALSG into SVN) most units were issued with specific identifying numbers.
See the posts by Rod http://remlr.com/forum/index.php?topic=441.msg3943#msg3943
These would be great in a sticky. Save some of us a lot of repetitive posting.
In the case of 87 Transport Platoon, back home in Puckapunyal we ran under our parent HQ's number on a RAASC blue/yellow plate. ie 25/522 which represented 25 Coy,/ 522- General Transport. When the unit was posted O/S, it went to Vietnam as an individual unit and was issued with the number 519 and the Div sign of 1ALSG - the logistical horses head.  Those with access to Stephen Taubert's book will see that the last Independent Transport Platoon was issued 518 back in the WWll days!
Our sister Unit in country was 1 Transport Platoon which belonged to 1 Tpt Coy (Div. Tpt.) and being already a Divisional Unit, the parent Company went overseas with their own Tac sign, RAASC colours and the number 70, but 1 Platoon was issued with the number 31.
When 1 Platoon shipped out of Sydney to go O/S this left a gaping hole in Divisional Transport requirements back home (important for training purposes for the proposed relief force for the following year)  so a replacement Platoon was raised. It was designated 12 Platoon and this Platoon automatically took the next Tactical number 32.      Confused yet?
When in 1967 1 Platoon was relieved by 2 Platoon RAASC, the logical next number had already been allocated to 12 Platoon, hence 2 Platoon took the NEXT number, 33 as its Tac number.

26 Company had replaced 25 Company back here in Australia, and so when a separate Transport Platoon and its inherent administrating Company HQ eventually arrived in country (see comments from 1 Coy Commdrs diaries approx 16 months earlier) it bore its Aussie Tac sign of 26/522 (26 Coy/ 522 -General Transport) and its Platoon didn't actually have any specific number allocated so it took the number 86 on a Blue/Yellow background to differentiate itself from the Coy HQ.
I assume 85 Platoon did the same for the same reason, but here I am in a bit of a quandary as I was always lead to believe that the idea of Tac signs was to signify the identity of the parent unit without being blatantly obvious to any enemy observers, hence the (what seems to outsiders) random issue of seemingly irrelevant numbers.
My suspicion is that the Units themselves took these numbers possibly as a "Unit pride" thing rather than as an official directive, but I could easily be wrong.

As for the Artillery sign I do not know who 47 was but there may be some Arty people who could tell us. I don't know what the Div Loc Battery signs were.
Regards
Glen
 

Offline Diana Alan

  • REMLR Inc
  • Veteran
  • *
  • Posts: 2238
  • THANKS 108
Re: REMLR list of Tac numbers SVN etc
« Reply #9 on: April 11, 2013, 07:43:18 PM »
Isn't Infantry or at least Infantry HQ horizontal red-blue tac, where artillery is the diagonal red blue?
REMLR 240.
Perentie FFR 50-422, SIII FFR 30-146, SIIA GunBuggy 112-726, Mk3 Inter 170-437, ex-SADF SIIB/SIII Radio Relay,
Army Trailers: No5 x 2, W/S x 2, PT1-1.2, Horndraulic ATR dog trailer.
Civilian: MY85 RRc HiLine 4.6, MY51 ex-RACQ 80", MY91 Defender/Reynolds Boughton 6x6, MY12 D4 SDV6

Offline Diana Alan

  • REMLR Inc
  • Veteran
  • *
  • Posts: 2238
  • THANKS 108
Re: REMLR list of Tac numbers SVN etc
« Reply #10 on: April 11, 2013, 07:59:34 PM »
Signs similar to Stephen Tauberts book

1 Pentropic Div - 1 ATF Vietnam - HQ Army - HQ Logistics
REMLR 240.
Perentie FFR 50-422, SIII FFR 30-146, SIIA GunBuggy 112-726, Mk3 Inter 170-437, ex-SADF SIIB/SIII Radio Relay,
Army Trailers: No5 x 2, W/S x 2, PT1-1.2, Horndraulic ATR dog trailer.
Civilian: MY85 RRc HiLine 4.6, MY51 ex-RACQ 80", MY91 Defender/Reynolds Boughton 6x6, MY12 D4 SDV6

Offline Carzee

  • REMLR Committee
  • Veteran
  • ***
  • Posts: 3298
  • THANKS 148
  • Perentie FFR 50-257
    • Perentie Wiki
  • Location: Canberra
  • REMLR No: 007
Re: REMLR list of Tac numbers SVN etc
« Reply #11 on: April 11, 2013, 08:05:04 PM »
I remember making up the RAR in-country list of known dates: http://www.remlr.com/vtours.html
I don't recall where I got the info. A book somewhere. I'll search my little library.

All the Inf tacs were on a red background and all were also wearing the 1ATF red rat formation sign (being based at Nui Dat -is that half right or 100percent?)
I'd like to match up the 7RAR etc to the right numbers. eg 55, 60 etc

Offline zulu delta 534

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 247
  • THANKS 99
  • Location: Loganlea
  • REMLR No: 226
Re: REMLR list of Tac numbers SVN etc
« Reply #12 on: April 11, 2013, 08:15:49 PM »
Infantry is plain red.
Ordnance used the same colours as Arty but they had three upright bars,- Red Blue Red.
Some Artillery signs used the diagonal division but that was usually on their "third" Tac sign designating a position within a battery.
Not knowing anything about the particular photograph (I am flying blind here), if it is a later shot (post SVN) it could possibly be a later RACT Tac sign. Diagonal blue, red, blue colours.

The number 47 tjough definitely fits in with Artillery.

7 RAR was 61. The easiest one to remember is 6 RAR being 60. From this base, simply either add or subtract numbers for each Bns' identity.
1RAR 55
2 - 56
3 - 57
4 - 58
5 - 59
6 - 60
7 - 61
8 - 62
9 - 63.
Simple once you get the hang of it.

Regards
Glen

Offline Carzee

  • REMLR Committee
  • Veteran
  • ***
  • Posts: 3298
  • THANKS 148
  • Perentie FFR 50-257
    • Perentie Wiki
  • Location: Canberra
  • REMLR No: 007
Re: REMLR list of Tac numbers SVN etc
« Reply #13 on: April 11, 2013, 08:38:12 PM »
:) thx again Glen.

I was just looking around the Ausvets site: eg 1967 http://www.ausvets.com.au/vietnam/1967/ops1967.htm and the linked Op orders showing attachments on Ops. There's a load of info in them and they can tell you which RAE or RASigs etc etc was in country at a particular time:  eg http://www.ausvets.com.au/vietnam/war%20diaries/opord_santafe.pdf

If this SVN tac "sticky" page idea was aiming to be thorough.... it'd be a huge job.

Offline Mike C

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 329
  • THANKS 90
  • Location: Somewhere in Smalltown, USA
Re: REMLR list of Tac numbers SVN etc
« Reply #14 on: April 12, 2013, 01:26:28 AM »
Haven't looked at the REMLR page as yet, but if you used M&D as the starting point, the number for 1 FDT (1st Forward Delivery Troop, RAAC) is incorrect (hey, I never said the book was perfect! :o) - I think it was 46, not 41, but I'll have to confirm that.

401 was Headquarters, AAFV and Headquarters, AFV (Army Component) .... same unit, different times. 403 is correctly listed as 104 Sig Sqn.

Of course, you'll be compiling a list of UNIT SERIAL NUMBERS too, won't you?  The four digit serial unique to each unit used for identifying equipment and stores.


Mike C