Author Topic: PYP: Command Recon  (Read 9502 times)

Offline juddy

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Re: PYP: Command Recon
« Reply #15 on: August 16, 2012, 04:41:51 PM »
Off topic or not; this is what I want from REMLR.
Thanks.

???????
1991 110 Truck Surveillance (RFSV), Winch MC2 *51-656*
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Offline zulu delta 534

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Re: PYP: Command Recon
« Reply #16 on: August 16, 2012, 05:41:29 PM »
As for demobbing, the army buys their light/medium GS vehicles with an expected lifespan of around ten years or so. This life span and its projected costs were all taken into account in the initial purchase price (we general public always seem to be flabbergasted on hearing cost quoted in the media re new vehicles but we never take into consideration, consumables, maintenance costs, replacement part costs etc. that are all included initially!). (As an exercise try and work out what your current car will cost to run for ten years, taking into account possible accident repairs, component failures and replacement, and general maintenance).
This lifespan is known as the vehicle's Economic life.
Accordingly an equation is drawn up covering estimated length of service, ongoing maintenance and repair costs and a few other odds and sods, and from this information, a figure is formulated that equates to the amount of money that can economically be spent on this vehicle to keep it operable during its lifetime.
Some hard working vehicles may run out of their 'Economic lifespan' early in their career (may suffer extreme chassis damage, salt water submersion or the likes of such) and the amassed costs of refurbishment to a 'combat ready piece of equipment' is so great that it is auctioned off to the public early (to recoup some of the initial cost) rather than refurbished. A write off such as this will be noted as 'BER' -Beyond Economic Repair.
With this in mind you will soon work out that there was no real set date for demob across the board, but vehicles posted to a GS Unit or 'Arm' usually would have been done as soon as a replacement was available, whereas some of the lesser mileage ones possibly saw an extended service life with CMF units and F1A reserves.
This BER system comes to light in the REMLR ARN lists, especially obvious in the Mk3 Inter section where many of these vehicles were re-bodied, many re-powered and a some even re-chassised and all well within their allotted economic lifetime.
In the case of "man hour expensive" vehicles such as ambulances, gunbuggies and the likes of such the lifetime allowance would have been "stretched" to cover the initial build cost, and in the specific case of Firey's S2 88" workshop, the lifetime was extended extensively by applying the complete machine as a training aid where the vehicle itself's life was not under any threat.
Same principal applied to many RAEME training aids such as cut away transmissions, engines etc..
When talking more modern times it will become obvious that some of the Perentie fleet,  Macks and others have been granted extended lives mainly because of the lack of availability of suitable replacement equipment.
CL vehicles were a different kettle of fish in that they were replaced very regularly (2-4 years or so) so as to gain a reasonable price at auction. The government didn't pay sales tax so they got the vehicles relatively cheaply and if they sold them off quickly enough they could almost recoup their initial costs.
Regards
Glen

Offline korg20000bc

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Re: PYP: Command Recon
« Reply #17 on: August 16, 2012, 06:02:54 PM »
Off topic or not; this is what I want from REMLR.
Thanks.

???????
I'm saying that this is the type of knowledge that I appreciate being shared.
Your name will also go on zee list!

Tommy

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Re: PYP: Command Recon
« Reply #18 on: August 16, 2012, 06:38:29 PM »
Truck, Utility, 1/4 Ton, GS, With Stretcher Frame
« Last Edit: August 16, 2012, 06:41:33 PM by Tommy »

Tommy

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Re: PYP: Command Recon
« Reply #19 on: August 16, 2012, 07:01:55 PM »
This photo looks to have been taken in Papua New Guinea.

Offline juddy

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Re: PYP: Command Recon
« Reply #20 on: August 16, 2012, 10:18:33 PM »
Truck, Utility, 1/4 Ton, GS, With Stretcher Frame

Thats a good picture.....
1991 110 Truck Surveillance (RFSV), Winch MC2 *51-656*
2004 Truck, Carryall, Lightweight, Modified Military Special, With Winch, MC2/3 205-301, Haulmark PT1-1.2 *205090* No5 Trailer

Images 2008-2017 J Burton

Offline Gecko

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Re: PYP: Command Recon
« Reply #21 on: August 17, 2012, 06:23:05 PM »
Going back to the SWB discussion Glen, any thoeries why they used the SWB for the Gun Buggy platform?
I'd have thought the LWB would have been the logical solution.
Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana.

Offline cookey

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Re: PYP: Command Recon
« Reply #22 on: August 17, 2012, 09:03:03 PM »

Accordingly an equation is drawn up covering estimated length of service, ongoing maintenance and repair costs and a few other odds and sods, and from this information, a figure is formulated that equates to the amount of money that can economically be spent on this vehicle to keep it operable during its lifetime.
Some hard working vehicles may run out of their 'Economic lifespan' early in their career (may suffer extreme chassis damage, salt water submersion or the likes of such) and the amassed costs of refurbishment to a 'combat ready piece of equipment' is so great that it is auctioned off to the public early (to recoup some of the initial cost) rather than refurbished. A write off such as this will be noted as 'BER' -Beyond Economic Repair.



Regards
Glen



Very well written.
When I was in RAEME, in addition to this, all vehicles had what was termed a "one time repair limit". This was calculated in man hours only, as presumably the "spare parts" were already in the system, and as such could be used up.

I well remember spending 2 weeks working on a Studebaker fire tanker --- complete brake o/haul, new clutch, carby o/haul, steering box replacement, etc, etc.
When finished the vehicle went to have an "out" inspection and they couldn't start the fire pump engine, which had no compression. (this was not on the repair order). Upon checking the paperwork it was noted that the time already taken in  repairs was very close to the "one time repair limit" (within 2 hours), and therefore the truck was classified BER and sent to be disposed of (auctioned). Someone got a good buy.

cookey
« Last Edit: August 17, 2012, 09:25:43 PM by cookey »
lost count

Offline zulu delta 534

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Re: PYP: Command Recon
« Reply #23 on: August 21, 2012, 11:18:25 AM »
The recoilless weapon required a transport platform that was agile, small, light, manoeuvrable, air transportable and also had to meet a lot of other criteria. The one major factor that put a long base vehicle out of the picture was the arc of fire possible from a long base vehicle.
Remember that the concussion blast from the muzzle of this weapon was just as bad as the expelled recoil forces that were vented out the back, meaning that anything in within 30 feet in front of or behind the weapon was obliterated by concussion when the weapon was fired. Any crewman who was careless enough to step back or forward too far would have his eardrums badly and irreparably damaged. (There is a film clip released by the Army PR mob somewhere on here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RDjeYePAU1s where you can see an inexperienced gunner being directed forward by his crew commander before firing on a training exercise! There is also another video floating around somewhere in cyberspace on youtube that shows some highly intelligent Libyan rebel cowboy firing a 106 from a toyota http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BwlrJ8Cam9I&feature=related .  Both of these videos may tend to show some of the concussive forces that are expelled by this weapon.)
A 109" platform therefore, simply because of its overall length being so much longer than the weapon, severely limited the arc of fire of the carried weapon to around 40degrees either side, whereas the little shorty offered almost a 360 degree arc of fire. This arc of fire made the vehicle about ten times more versatile in a tactical hull down attack position than any long wheel base vehicle could ever offer.
It was for these very same reasons (flash points of the weapon being at the vehicle's extremities) that the original 88inch 6005 was modified so extensively to carry this weapon in the first place, and what makes a gunbuggy so unique today.
(One of the most desirable ways of ambushing a tank or two was to obtain a hull down position overlooking the expected path of the target. Fire the tracer round, then follow with the 106. Unfortunately once the major weapon was fired the muzzle flash gave away any secrecy in regards to your position, so the crew of four mounted the vehicle rather hurriedly, reversed out of the position, being ever so careful not to brake too heavily in reverse so as to avoid tumbling over end for end, then hightailed it out to the next position.
I find myself in a strange position today, as back in my much younger days attached to ADE and TPW at Monegeeta and later, Tropical Trials, I used to wonder whether most of the boffins of ADE were bits of bone heads, but then not too much later in my time I was lucky enough (In a way I suppose) to actually use some of their products in the situation for which they were designed, and  today, I can look at some of their designs and put them in context with what was actually going on at the time and what was available, and blessed with the marvel of hindsight, I marvel at their ingenuity.
Regards
Glen

Offline Chazza

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Re: PYP: Command Recon
« Reply #24 on: August 31, 2012, 06:40:29 PM »
Top description Glen! :D

I remember watching an American training film when I did my Battalion Weapons course and one of the significant disadvantages of the rifle, was the dust and debris cloud raised by the back-blast. The film showed the rifle fired from a tri-pod and then fired from a poor little jeep, with the driver high-tailing it as soon as they had fired. A lesson I never forgot!

Cheers Charlie
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Offline Roverray

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Re: PYP: Command Recon
« Reply #25 on: June 26, 2013, 12:48:59 AM »
When were the CR demobbed?
We purchased two CRs in our family. My brother bought his in Sydney in 1967 I think, it was Bronze Green with a Brush Bar and Capstan Winch and I bought mine in Townsville in 1969. It was Olive Drab no bar or winch. I remember I travelled to Townsville by train spent a day going over CRs and making inspection notes. Purchased it the next afternoon at the sale for $600, Got a lift into Garbut a picked up a new Battery and I think Qld Transport had a officer on site to issue permits, drove it off site checked the oils filled it with fuel and Drove South to Mackay that night in Convoy with a fellow in a 109 he had bought. 
I remember there were a number of CRs in the sale and I dont remember any of the Townsville CRs having Brush Bars.
When you consider that back then a new SWB was $3500 the sale prices were about 1/6th of a new vehicle (given they were only 10 years old)
S2 CR 110-408
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Collectors: RR Clasic, S1 80, 107, S 3 120 D/Cab V6 D