Author Topic: ADF Scammell/Leyland Contractor ARNs and Photos  (Read 23939 times)

Offline juddy

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Re: ADF Scammell/Leyland Contractor ARNs and Photos
« Reply #30 on: August 14, 2013, 12:31:35 PM »
My thoughts are, the standard set up for this vehicle were as in the pictures below, these are all UK pictures from the many books i have, I think due to the different conditions here, and the need for the lamps to see further ahead, they were re located to above the bumper.



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[URL=http://s856.photobucket.com/user/juddyburton/media/Screenshot2013-08-14at122603PM_zpse08b5c68.png.html]
« Last Edit: August 14, 2013, 12:35:29 PM by juddy »
1991 110 Truck Surveillance (RFSV), Winch MC2 *51-656*
2004 Truck, Carryall, Lightweight, Modified Military Special, With Winch, MC2/3 205-301, Haulmark PT1-1.2 *205090* No5 Trailer

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Offline juddy

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Re: ADF Scammell/Leyland Contractor ARNs and Photos
« Reply #31 on: August 14, 2013, 12:37:11 PM »
1991 110 Truck Surveillance (RFSV), Winch MC2 *51-656*
2004 Truck, Carryall, Lightweight, Modified Military Special, With Winch, MC2/3 205-301, Haulmark PT1-1.2 *205090* No5 Trailer

Images 2008-2017 J Burton

Offline Diana Alan

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Re: ADF Scammell/Leyland Contractor ARNs and Photos
« Reply #32 on: August 14, 2013, 12:42:56 PM »
Thanks for the other piccys Justin.

Tommy and Justin, I think you are both right, the lights above the bumper seem to be a fairly standard option in the UK as well as on the ones in Aus.  There is nothing worse when on long undulating roads to have the headlamps so low that they don't see into the potholes and washouts or see the bull in the centre of the road after a crest.

As for fog lamps, I always have the fog lamps set to come on with the side lamps, that way in thick fog the low set fog lamps give enough light to see the sides of the road and a little way ahead without the reflected glare of the main headlamps.  In my '85 RRclassic it meant I had to unwind part of the electrical harness to remove the permanent joint into the headlamp circuit and re-attach it to the side lamp circuit.

Diana
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Re: ADF Scammell/Leyland Contractor ARNs and Photos
« Reply #33 on: August 14, 2013, 01:34:39 PM »
Close up of the light on an Israeli Contractor (Same lighting setup as the Aussies had). The two lamps look identical. The main lamp look to be tilted slightly back. Maybe this is to give a larger illumination area when both lamps are on.

I can only assume that these bumper lights were a standard Scammel/Leyland option. If so, the lamp shown in the photo below should be the same as the Australian Contractors.

The lower photo shows the Israeli Leyland Contractor No.1. Apparently they were the same spec as the Australian model (Wilson 8F2R box, one piece wheels and "full" cab).
« Last Edit: August 14, 2013, 01:59:18 PM by Tommy »

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Re: ADF Scammell/Leyland Contractor ARNs and Photos
« Reply #34 on: August 14, 2013, 02:22:34 PM »
Contractor 172-52? (photo taken 1960's). The last number could be a 9. Mike Cecil may be able to help out with this one.

I have noticed that during the early years of the Contractor use, the ARN plate sits up high on the front bar work whereas the later years they are mounted lower down on the bumper. This Contractor also has the side engine panels in situ.
« Last Edit: August 16, 2013, 11:18:16 AM by Tommy »

Offline Diana Alan

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Re: ADF Scammell/Leyland Contractor ARNs and Photos
« Reply #35 on: August 14, 2013, 02:53:13 PM »
I think the side covers were a case of ambient temperatures, out west, in the desert and wet tropics the removal of the side covers would allow better air flow to keep the engines cooler. in the south and alpine regions, like the UK the side covers in place would retain the heat to preserve the best operational temps.

A bit like the vinyl radiator covers you see on many prime movers.
REMLR 240.
Perentie FFR 50-422, SIII FFR 30-146, SIIA GunBuggy 112-726, Mk3 Inter 170-437, ex-SADF SIIB/SIII Radio Relay,
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Civilian: MY85 RRc HiLine 4.6, MY51 ex-RACQ 80", MY91 Defender/Reynolds Boughton 6x6, MY12 D4 SDV6

Offline Diana Alan

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Re: ADF Scammell/Leyland Contractor ARNs and Photos
« Reply #36 on: August 14, 2013, 06:46:59 PM »
Close up of the light on an Israeli Contractor (Same lighting setup as the Aussies had). The two lamps look identical. The main lamp look to be tilted slightly back. Maybe this is to give a larger illumination area when both lamps are on.

I can only assume that these bumper lights were a standard Scammel/Leyland option. If so, the lamp shown in the photo below should be the same as the Australian Contractors.

The lower photo shows the Israeli Leyland Contractor No.1. Apparently they were the same spec as the Australian model (Wilson 8F2R box, one piece wheels and "full" cab).
Were the Aussie Contractors fitted with a Wilson pre-select gearbox?

I thought it was a Leyland pneumocyclic semi-automatic, similar to the ones in the Leyland Atlantean and Leopard buses used by the PTC/UTC in Sydney.

Apparently it was a Self-Changing Gears RB30 semi-automatic.
« Last Edit: August 14, 2013, 07:29:13 PM by Diana Alan »
REMLR 240.
Perentie FFR 50-422, SIII FFR 30-146, SIIA GunBuggy 112-726, Mk3 Inter 170-437, ex-SADF SIIB/SIII Radio Relay,
Army Trailers: No5 x 2, W/S x 2, PT1-1.2, Horndraulic ATR dog trailer.
Civilian: MY85 RRc HiLine 4.6, MY51 ex-RACQ 80", MY91 Defender/Reynolds Boughton 6x6, MY12 D4 SDV6

Offline Richard Farrant

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Re: ADF Scammell/Leyland Contractor ARNs and Photos
« Reply #37 on: August 15, 2013, 06:49:44 AM »
Were the Aussie Contractors fitted with a Wilson pre-select gearbox?

Apparently it was a Self-Changing Gears RB30 semi-automatic.

Diana,
One and the same really ...... Major W Wilson who designed the pre-selector epicyclic box, formed a company called Improved Gears Ltd, later changed to Self Changing Gears Ltd. The RB30 is of the same principle as the original type of Wilson box, but it is the controls that are different, instead of selecting a gear and engaging when you were ready, the Semi-auto had a small lever that both selected and engaged by servo action from air or hydraulics depending on the application. I have been involved with Wilson type boxes over a period of 35 years or more now and they are always known as Wilson as he was the principle designer. The RB30 is not an auto box in the sense of an Allison, ZF, etc.
A fascinating subject .....
regards, Richard
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Offline Diana Alan

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Re: ADF Scammell/Leyland Contractor ARNs and Photos
« Reply #38 on: August 15, 2013, 08:24:41 AM »
Hi Richard

I understand what you're saying and that the manufacturer is the successor company but the RB30 is different generation to the Wilson pre-select principly in the change mechanism using pneumatic controls to change gears rather than with the mechanical linkage and foot operated change pedal.  No one would call a flappy paddle gearbox in a modern car a Wilson although their heritage comes in a direct line to the gearbox designed by Maj Wilson and made famous in cars, buses and armoured vehicles like the WWII Matilda tank and Post-War Fox or Ferrett.

Thats my take on it in any case.
Diana 
« Last Edit: August 15, 2013, 08:32:48 AM by Diana Alan »
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Civilian: MY85 RRc HiLine 4.6, MY51 ex-RACQ 80", MY91 Defender/Reynolds Boughton 6x6, MY12 D4 SDV6

Offline Richard Farrant

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Re: ADF Scammell/Leyland Contractor ARNs and Photos
« Reply #39 on: August 15, 2013, 09:28:05 AM »

Thats my take on it in any case.



Diana,
that is quite true what you say, but my point is that the "running gear" inside is of same design just the peripheral controls that are different, eliminating the gear change pedal to the bus bar and having the selector linked via servo to operate the busbar at same time as selection.  An improved version of the original design. That is my personal take. Interesting discussion, thanks.
Richard
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1943 Daimler Scout Car

Offline Diana Alan

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Re: ADF Scammell/Leyland Contractor ARNs and Photos
« Reply #40 on: August 15, 2013, 10:56:13 AM »
Diana,
that is quite true what you say, but my point is that the "running gear" inside is of same design just the peripheral controls that are different,
Quote from: Richard Farrant
The RB30 is not an auto box in the sense of an Allison, ZF, etc.

A fascinating subject .....
We seem to debating to agree with each other, if the different change mechanisms are essentially irrellevant to the use of the term Wilson gearbox, then under the same premise we could say the same of an Alison, ZF, etc to use your words.

enough of that, I'm raising Tommy's blood pressure! :)

and onto another tangent regarding the ZF, do you know much of the details of the ZF fitted to the re-fitted upgraded M113-A4?
 
« Last Edit: August 15, 2013, 12:13:41 PM by Diana Alan »
REMLR 240.
Perentie FFR 50-422, SIII FFR 30-146, SIIA GunBuggy 112-726, Mk3 Inter 170-437, ex-SADF SIIB/SIII Radio Relay,
Army Trailers: No5 x 2, W/S x 2, PT1-1.2, Horndraulic ATR dog trailer.
Civilian: MY85 RRc HiLine 4.6, MY51 ex-RACQ 80", MY91 Defender/Reynolds Boughton 6x6, MY12 D4 SDV6

Offline Mike C

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Re: ADF Scammell/Leyland Contractor ARNs and Photos
« Reply #41 on: August 16, 2013, 04:38:21 AM »
Tommy...

Nice pic: I have an original print of it somewhere, so will have a look for the ARN. The sign plate on the Cent is curious 'X9'?? Must have been an Armoured Centre vehicle. The one behind ('23') is Troop Leader, 3 Troop B Squadron, so a 1AR vehicle. I've never worked out where it was taken: any ideas?

Did you scan this from the Army Newspaper?

Mike C

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Re: ADF Scammell/Leyland Contractor ARNs and Photos
« Reply #42 on: August 16, 2013, 09:58:29 AM »
Tommy...

Nice pic: I have an original print of it somewhere, so will have a look for the ARN. The sign plate on the Cent is curious 'X9'?? Must have been an Armoured Centre vehicle. The one behind ('23') is Troop Leader, 3 Troop B Squadron, so a 1AR vehicle. I've never worked out where it was taken: any ideas?

Did you scan this from the Army Newspaper?

Mike C

G'day Mike

Photo taken from a internet website.

http://books.historia.com.au/equal-to-the-task_v1-raasc/e1-p2_states/e1-c8_vic.html

Caption stated that the location was Hume Hwy, 1960's.
« Last Edit: August 16, 2013, 11:17:58 AM by Tommy »

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Re: ADF Scammell/Leyland Contractor
« Reply #43 on: August 16, 2013, 01:38:19 PM »
Not exactly sure of the ARN from this closeup.

It has the Leyland badge on the bonnet too.



This is a clearer image. Definately 101-969 :)

Offline Mike C

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Re: ADF Scammell/Leyland Contractor ARNs and Photos
« Reply #44 on: August 19, 2013, 12:18:44 PM »
Tommy,

Thanks for the location of the image: Ahhhh, captions: don't ya just love em? See full caption below: Says its 1960s, then that the Contractor entered service in 1970, then that it was moving vintage tanks to the Armoured Museum, which puts in well past 1977 when Centurion left service and was placed into storage. The tanks were not allocated to the Museum until the t980s, and the dual highway would tend to support a later date than the 1960s.  And the fleet's primary function was moving the Main Battle Tank of the period, for all manner of units, not just 1AR: 1COD, 4Base, Armoured Centre, RAEME Training Centre....
 
Am yet to locate my copy of the image for the ARN...

Mike C

"Moving armoured vehicles
 Hume Highway 1960s

158 Tk Tptr Pl of 26 Coy was reequipped with the Leyland Contractor prime mover in 1970, making it once more an effective operator, the previous wartime carryover Diamond Ts having long passed effective life.

While the platoon's primary function was movement of the Centurion tank fleet of 1st Armoured Regiment, its heavy lift capacity was put to various other uses. Here the unit is assisting in moving vintage tanks to Puckapunyal to form part to the armoured museum collection."